(Randomly, is this not one of the weirdest covers I have found yet? I bet it was made in the '70s. All '70s book covers are bizarre.)
It's very nice of the Palmers to arrive and cheer us all up after Edward's melancholy departure. I never noticed before how much Edward's leaving mirrors Willoughby's -- both are sad about having to leave, and leave behind many questions about their behavior. Elinor tried to convince her mother and sister not to keep excusing Willoughby's more inexplicable actions... and now she's finding all kinds of excuses for Edward's fluctuating attentions. This does round out her character nicely, showing that she's not infallible.
Of course, Edward has been a lot more circumspect in his behavior. In fact, he's kind of the reverse image of Willoughby -- Willoughby was much too uninhibited, and Edward is too inhibited. I think Austen is pointing out here that a middle ground is much better than one extreme or the other, rather like she does with Marianne being too little in control of her emotions, and Elinor sometimes too much.
Speaking of Edward, all through his discussion of his lack of any kind of useful thing to do with his time, I kept thinking what a blessing work is. We tend to moan and groan about work, but it's actually a blessing from God that keeps us from the emotional and physical idleness that can make us dissatisfied, even get us into trouble. Idle young men with no need to earn their keep, like Willoughby and Edward, certainly can get themselves (and others) into an awful lot of trouble that could have been avoided if they just had something to do to occupy themselves.
Lastly, I love Elinor's observation of Mr. Palmer that he is wishing for "distinction" that made him turn up his nose at absolutely everyone and everything. "It was the desire of appearing superior to other people" (p. 212) that made him decide he disliked everything, not an actual fault in those things. I was just discussing this with my bff last night, how we can't understand people who go around looking for reasons to dislike things or people, or who seem like they can't be happy unless they find something to be offended by. It certainly sounds like a miserable way to live your life. I really do think a lot of people have the idea that if they tell everyone how much they don't like something, it will make them seem intelligent and discerning, so they find flaws and faults in every movie, book, author, acquaintance, painting, whatever. And it really just makes them seem petty and arrogant. I often struggle to be patient with people like that, I'm afraid. I often just want to roll my eyes at them and say, "Get over yourself already. Allow yourself to enjoy things and admit it!"
Er, sorry for the little rant there. I was just pleased to find something in our reading today that addressed that!.
Discussion Questions:
1. Elinor thinks that Mr. Palmer's realization that he married a very silly woman has made him kind of crabby, but "she knew this kind of blunder was too common for any sensible man to be lastingly hurt by it" (p. 212). Can you think of any other instances in Austen's books where a sensible man has married a very silly woman? Has it hurt them?
2. Does anyone here actually believe Col. Brandon would ever have married Charlotte (Jennings) Palmer?
Hmmm, I tend to be hypercritical, not out of distinction though, it's my nature. I do think I need to moderate it, I know in many ways it's wrong, but I think I am a critical thinker that then turns out of the thinking skills into the path of negativity. However, when thinking about how to describe things I like for more balance, for some reason I do find it hard to describe why I love something, I don't know how to get it just so in the same why I can describe why I don't like something, also some things I love it seems almost sacrilege to speak of, like it spoils it somehow (and that seems like something Marianne just said).
ReplyDelete1. Elinor thinks that Mr. Palmer's realization that he married a very silly woman has made him kind of crabby, but "she knew this kind of blunder was too common for any sensible man to be lastingly hurt by it" (p. 212). Can you think of any other instances in Austen's books where a sensible man has married a very silly woman? Has it hurt them?
Mr. Bennet seems to be the prime example, and he allowed it to hurt him and their daughters. Charles Musgrove seems to be a more decent person, certainly more sensible than Mary Elliot, he tried for Anne before Mary which shows sense and then he certainly demonstrates both more sense and heart in the book, though not an excess to be sure. I feel like there are other examples but I can't think of them.
2. Does anyone here actually believe Col. Brandon would ever have married Charlotte (Jennings) Palmer? Goodness no, I know Charlotte is very silly, but that seriously irritated me that she took it so for granted that he would just jump to have her. I don't love Colonel Brandon myself, but I do greatly respect him, and only Elinor and Mrs. Dashwood at all understand his worth. He must have been very patient to be among such silly friends before they came along.
Livia, that's interesting that loving something makes you feel like you would spoil it by talking about it! That's totally different from me, so I'm intrigued by that insight.
DeleteMr. Bennet came to mind for me too, but I hadn't thought of Charles Musgrove! You're so right. And possibly Anne Elliot's parents were a reverse-gender version of that, since her mother is described as having been very intelligent and down-to-earth, and her father is such a fop?
And you're so right, Brandon is clearly very patient to continue hanging out with these people.
1. Elinor thinks that Mr. Palmer's realization that he married a very silly woman has made him kind of crabby, but "she knew this kind of blunder was too common for any sensible man to be lastingly hurt by it" (p. 212). Can you think of any other instances in Austen's books where a sensible man has married a very silly woman? Has it hurt them?
ReplyDelete- Mr. and Mrs. Bennet. In spite of their differences, there is a genuine love for each other.
2. Does anyone here actually believe Col. Brandon would ever have married Charlotte (Jennings) Palmer?
- Possibly not. Why I'm not exactly sure. He's in love Marianne who isn't exactly the sharpest knife in the drawer either, but at least Marianne has tolerable relatives. The same thing can hardly be said for Charlotte.
Ivy Miranda, yes, the Bennets definitely came to my mind there!
DeleteI think Marianne is very intelligent, she just chooses to follow her feelings instead of her mind. She lacks some common sense, though.
I can't even imagine Col. Brandon with someone like Charlotte Palmer. I know that opposites attract, but that's just ridiculous - he's much too sensible for that. Marianne at least has intellect going for her, even though I don't usually agree with her opinions.
ReplyDeleteMom, yeeeees, I think Charlotte was being fairly delusional about Col. Brandon, as she even says he never showed any interest in her!
DeleteThe Palmers utterly baffled me. At first, I thought Mr. Palmer was just insufferably rude, and Mrs. Palmer was pretending to be happy and cheerful and laugh it off to hide her embarrassment at his actions, and make other people take him less seriously. As the chapter wore on, I was forced to abandon that idea and accept that Mrs. Palmer really was so.... I don't even know what. Clueless? But she seems genuinely content in her marriage, and Mr. Palmer seems as happy as he can be with anything, so... *shrug* I don't know. They baffle me. Comedic interlude perhaps????
ReplyDelete2. I halfway can believe Col. Brandon would have considered marrying Charlotte Palmer. Knowing Charlotte (somewhat), I can easily believe she is exaggerating what happened in her favor, but I can see there being a kernel of truth in what she says. Col. Brandon does seem to like romantics. And him having had some degree of attraction to Charlotte gives me some understanding of what he might see in Marianne (something which I couldn't quite understand previously. I mean, sure he was attracted to her the first time he saw her because she was pretty, but after that? I couldn't quite figure it out).
AnnMarie, yeeeeees, they are definitely mostly here for comic relief at this point, and to introduce them so that they will be known to us later.
DeleteAnd you're right, Brandon likes people with a lot of energy and feeling, so I suppose Charlotte may have at least interested him a little bit at some point?
You know, the sort of interested like... I didn't know you at all. I saw you and thought you were pretty. I learned a tiny bit about you and I was interested. I learned more about you and I ran far, far away as fast as I could. That kind of interested. ;)
DeleteRoxann, yes. Superficially interested for a brief time ;-)
DeleteI love how opposite the Palmer's are. Reminds me a bit of my parents relationship, their like Night and Day and it's hilarious.
ReplyDeleteI never understand when people try to be all superior and picky, I love way too many things to be like that. I have to tell everyone.
The Palmers are just sooooo funny. And they seem to have made their marriage work, so who am I to scold them for being weird?
DeleteThe worst, to me, is when someone decides that because they don't like something, it's worthless, and they go around telling other people to stop liking it. Arrogant jerks. Sigh.